27 replies to this topic

[mikea]

Rodder,
One other thought - when you push the throttle forward and the engine begins to bog down, are you pushing the throttle slowly? What happens if you push it forward quickly? When it bogs down does it stall out, if you keep pushing the throttle? and if you pull the throttle back to neutral, does the engine stop chugging and idle at @1000 rpm?

You asked about the TPS earlier, and depending on your responses to these questions, it could tell if perhaps that is the problem. When my TPS went bad, I could idle at normal rpm and didn't really have a problem until I tried to accelerate. In my case, when the boat started to stall, I could get it to lurch back to speed, by pushing the throttle forward quickly before it stalled out. Because it ran great at idle and at also at wide open, zeroing in on that being the culprit took a while.

It doesn't sound like you can jump past the chugging, to get to wide open though. But then again, if the TPS has a large bad spot in the winding, or is just plan shot, that could be a problem, According to the service manual, one way to check the TPS is to use a volt/ohm meter and rotate the post to see if the resistance value goes up smoothly as you rotate it. I will tell you that when I tested mine that way, I wasn't able to detect inconsistant resistance as I rotated it, but I swapped it out - and the end result was that it worked. When tested using my diagnostic tester, showed it was reading a lower voltage value than it should have though.

Sorry, I couldn't recall if you had that part diagnosed or not.

[rodder77]

I did have the compression and spark checked by the first merc dealer (compression was good if i recall was 130-135 on all cylinders and spark on all cylinders, fuel sample and electronics were also reported back as good). Spark is apparatent since it idles very nicely. As far as the throttle i tried both ways numerous times, slowly try to get past idle and just shoving it foward to WOT, chuggs as if it will die no matter what until I return it to idle or slightly above idle. TPS- I have not checked that yet and I was hoping not to have to buy one as they are ~$500, for something that may or may not be the problem, I read the same in the manual that it does not control WOT and dismissed it since I can't get WOT. In addition it will rev up just fine on the trailer with the hose hooked up in forward (i know its a bad thing to do but had to check it briefly). I had another reply from another seadoo owner to my begging for help that indicated he had the same issue of the bogging down only runs at idle and it turned out to be the sensor in the oil reservior - i i have question back to him on some specifics). I don't recall if the low oil light was on as I was concentrating on the throttle, engine sound and speed (along with my utter frustration at the time). Sensor is cheap enough ~$50 if needed. Something i will check along with looking at the rubber exhaust tubes a little closer while the boat is running as well taking them off to look for any delamination inside as others have reported experiencing. It may have to go back to a different merc dealer, who hopefully has a DDT? to plug into the computer to help diagnois the problem for me before I go broke buying "the could be the issue parts" and summer is over. Not looking forward to the dealer....... i will keep you posted.

[mikea]

Okay - Compression was checked. Spark at idle doesn't mean it is good all the time, or good when it needs to change faster or more frequently. Having spark is a good thing, it means the components that generate a spark are working. The thing that it doesn't validate is that the components that signal it to change, when needed, are working. That is where the electronic control modules ans sensors come into play. You need a computer or other diagnostic device to check those, because without doing that you are simply guessing that they "might be" not working.
Once you are sure that they have a computer - have them check the trigger, stator, TPS, voltage regulators, and control modules (ignition control and main EFI module).
Yes - TPS is a more expensive part. Try looking for a used one from someone parting out a blown or bad engine - they do get posted once in a while but you have to search for them. I wouldn't buy anything else unless the diagnostic testing shows it is bad or at least suspect.
If you are able to - check the vacuum tubes that control the MAP sensor that is located inside the main EFI module. One vacuum tube is on the back lower going into a hole on the Control Module - you have to remove the control module to get to it. The other small vacuum tube is connected to the manifold behind the main EFI module. Check all for cracks and that they are pushed in. Something as simple as a vacuum tube associated with the MAP Sensor could also screw up the EFI Control Module and not allow the engine to advance when the throttle is asking for more fuel/spark/air mix.
Good Luck and I hope the issue is resolved soon.

[rodder77]

Had to breakdown (before I had one) and dropped it off at a Merc dealer who said they should be able to look at it...in 5-10 business days...ugh. They are swamped as it is a very seasonal business. I will keep you posted.

Curious for anyone who replaced a bad TPS what are the symptoms of a bad TPS? As it is electrical, does it just stop working at some point or is it a gradual thing?

[rodder77]

Well i think i'm going from bad to worse...took it to the dealer they came back and said the trigger was bad and wasn't supplying enough power to fire two sets of the injectors (makes sense based on the symptoms), they replaced the trigger. Put on a used one (that's a whole nother story.....that is still playing out). Put it in the water on Saturday to see if the trigger helped.....started great, idled great gave it power and...... the same issue is still there. Bogged right down and wouldn't go much over 6mph. Sputtered around at 6 mph, checked a couple other items while on the water. Pulled to fuel cap to rule out vacuum in the fuel tank and also checked the exhaust hoses for any obvious delaminiation...nothing.Sputtered around for about another 20 minutes and then heard a big clunk almost as we had hit a log. Speed dropped from six down to about 1 and would only idle. Engine would still rev up to about the same area that would get me to 6mph, however the boat wouldn't go any faster. Ran like the does when intake gets plugged with weeds. Engine rpms go up but the impeller is not pushing anywater.... I think the motor/pump may be done for (and the pockets are empty to fix anything else this season). Checked the grate and impeller at the ramp when we pulled it out, they looked fine. UGH

[mikea]

Oh man, that really sucks! Doesn't sound very good.
I wonder if the pump had been going bad on the initial ride - where you indicated that the longer you drove, the slower it went.
Could have been the pump going at that time - slowly.
Knock on wood, I haven't had any trouble with the pump end of the system, so I can't speak to what could have worn out or broke.
Sorry to hear the bad news - Hope you can get it resolved and back on the water before summer is over.

[rodder77]

Crooked Merc Dealer from hell -- thought I found a reputable merc dealer based on reccomendations, who knew the 240 EFI engine inside and out (rebuilds them etc) and really sounded honest on the phone to deal with - turned out to be the worst business I have ever dealt with on any vehicle or any product for that matter. Had great conversations with them on the problem and potential solutions. Well.. I took the boat back to get a "new" trigger put on since somehow they put a used one on the first time. I liked to think is was by accident to test if that was the issue and they forgot or someone didn't listen to instructions to put the actual new part on as should have been done . Either way they said they would make it right. So I call them today to see if they had any luck with finding the issue and getting her running correctly. Shop owner starts off the convesation my saying they refuse to work on my boat anymore and he accuses me of switching the new part ( $150 trigger) they supposedly put on for the piece of junk all corroded one they actually installed! I don't think I could or know how to get a flywheel off if my lif depended on it - that is well beyond my backyard mechanic ability and no possible way a $150 part is going to make me or break me, and I even brought it back for more work to be done expecting another $500-$1,000 bill to get me running correctly. On the day I originally picked up the boat I called them right after I picked up the boat and saw the used wire sticking out to tell them it was a used part they put on and I wanted to bring the boat back that day, they said nothing could be done over the weekend as they are closed. So today they (owner) accuse the customer (me) of switching parts and I did it because and I quote "have been around" (whatever that means) because I caught them in a bait and switch, which will I will be reporting next to the BBB and directly to Mercury just to make them aware. What kind of shop runs like this place ALMARS Mercury in New Castle DE - stay away at all costs) and stays in business. Never been that insulted by a dirtbag owner like this guy before. Either he does this as regular practice and hopes nobody ever looks, which I hope not, or someone on his staff is switching customers parts on him.They did put on the new one prior to me taking the boat back today but like I said, refused to work on the boat or try to fix the problem. What a crooked operation they run stay away - Almars Mercury in New Castle DE. I did do a quick check in the engine compartment to make sure they didn't strip any of my engine parts off or cause any obvios damage. Left work to get right after the call as I did not trust them to keep it over the weekend without taking parts off or damaging it. Need to find a reputable merc dealer or mechanic in the area now, while I inform everyone at the marina and friends on the water of what shop to stay away from. I will keep you all posted.

[rodder77]

UPDATE : Well - took it to a reputable Mercury dealer for service. Issue was found to be plugged fuel injectors. Simple but expensive solution, pull the injectors and send them out to be cleaned/rebuilt. Big cost was the labor involved by the need for them to pull the motor to get to the injectors. The shop they were sent to for cleaning ran a before and after analysis - before numbers and spray patterns were awful - after their service thay were all matched and at least as good (if not better) as when they came from the factory. Runs like a champ now! 54-55mph (faster than it ever has). Shop believes the most likely cause was the ethanol in the fuel plus the sea foam literally cleaning all the varnish and it getting through all the filters to the injectors. Hopefully a few more nice weekends of the season left to enjoy - thanks for everyones help and ideas on the forum!